ChinaPower

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China’s Quest for Military Supremacy: A Conversation with Dr. Joel Wuthnow and Dr. Phil Saunders
In this episode of the ChinaPower Podcast, Dr. Joel Wuthnow and Dr. Phil Saunders join us to discuss their new book on the People’s Liberation Army (PLA): “China’s Quest for Military Supremacy.” They begin by explaining the motivations behind their book and the growing demand for a comprehensive resource on the PLA among students, policymakers, and defense practitioners. Dr. Wuthnow then outlines how the PLA has entered a “new era” under Xi Jinping, characterized by greater confidence, structural reforms, and an expanding operational reach. Dr. Saunders then highlights how the PLA is increasingly being used to shape the Indo-Pacific region, citing China’s recent live-fire exercises near Australia and New Zealand as an example of its more assertive posture. Both experts also delve into key challenges facing the PLA, from Xi Jinping’s efforts to tighten party control to persistent corruption and political reliability issues. They also assess how the PLA’s rigid command structure and political indoctrination could undermine effectiveness in a crisis. Finally, the two experts assess the PLA’s progress becoming more joint, its nuclear modernization efforts, and the broader implications for U.S. and regional security. They conclude by discussing their views on how a second Trump administration could impact PLA behavior and China's strategic calculations. Dr. Joel Wuthnow is a senior research fellow in the Center for the Study of Chinese Military Affairs within the Institute for National Strategic Studies at NDU. His research areas include Chinese foreign and security policy, Chinese military affairs, U.S.-China relations, and strategic developments in East Asia. In addition to his duties in INSS, he also serves as an adjunct professor in the Edmund A. Walsh School of Foreign Service at Georgetown University. Dr. Phillip C. Saunders is Director of the INSS Center for the Study of Chinese Military Affairs. Dr. Saunders previously worked at the Monterey Institute of International Studies, where he served as Director of the East Asia Nonproliferation Program from 1999-2003. He also serves as an adjunct instructor at the School of Advanced International Studies at Johns Hopkins University.
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46:11
U.S., China, and Economic Warfare: A Conversation with Mr. Edward Fishman
In this episode of the ChinaPower Podcast, Mr. Edward Fishman joins us to discuss the evolving landscape of economic warfare and the United States’ strategic use of economic tools against China and other global actors. Drawing from his new book, Chokepoints: American Power in the Age of Economic Warfare, he explains how sanctions, tariffs, and export controls have become central to great power competition and explores how today’s hyper-globalized economy has created chokepoints—critical areas where one state holds a dominant position, allowing for few alternatives. He examines the most potent weapons in the U.S. economic arsenal, and how their use—or mere threat—can compel adversaries to shift behavior. Mr. Fishman provides an insider’s account of the Trump administration’s economic warfare strategy against China and the rationale behind its approach. He also analyzes China’s dual-track approach to economic warfare, the Biden administration’s use of economic warfare against Russia, and the role of U.S. firms in carrying out Washington’s policies. He concludes with recommendations for how the U.S. can refine its strategy to more effectively compete with China. Edward Fishman is a leading authority on economic statecraft and sanctions. He teaches at Columbia University’s School of International and Public Affairs and is a senior research scholar at the Center on Global Energy Policy. He also advises companies on geopolitical strategy and invests in early-stage technology startups. Previously, he served at the U.S. State Department as a member of the Secretary of State’s Policy Planning Staff, at the Pentagon as an advisor to the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and at the U.S. Treasury Department as special assistant to the Under Secretary for Terrorism and Financial Intelligence. His writing and analysis are regularly featured by outlets such as The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, The Washington Post, Foreign Affairs, Politico, and NPR. He holds a BA in History from Yale, an MPhil in International Relations from Cambridge, and an MBA from Stanford.
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41:15
U.S.-China Subnational Diplomacy: A Conversation with Dr. Kyle Jaros and Dr. Sara Newland
In this episode of the ChinaPower Podcast, Dr. Kyle Jaros and Dr. Sara Newland join us to explore the evolution of U.S.-China subnational diplomacy. They begin by examining the history and current landscape of US-China relations at the subnational level. They point out specifically that throughout the last five years, U.S.-China relations at the subnational level have become increasingly politicized. Dr. Newland explains that we are seeing a trickledown effect of local politicians weighing in on Taiwan and China issues, setting up local caucuses that mimic those in congress and notes that these actions are contributing to increased Sinophobia within U.S. local communities. Dr. Jaros further explains that in recent years, longstanding subnational ties with China have started winding down, with state and local leaders more hesitant to visit China, meet with Chinese officials, or welcome Chinese investments. They note this hesitation originates both from federal policy and from an increasingly hawkish stance at the sub-national level. However, both guests underscore that there are still areas of cooperation between U.S. and China on the local level, with one example being student exchange programs through universities. Dr. Jaros notes that it is important to continue human to human contacts with China and to be careful not to dehumanize the other side. Finally, Dr. Newland stresses the importance of the U.S. federal government creation of resources to educate local leaders on how to engage effectively with Chinese leaders. Kyle A. Jaros is an associate professor at the University of Notre Dame’s Keough School of Global Affairs, where he studies the politics of urban and regional development and governance and subnational foreign affairs, with a particular focus on China. He is the author of China’s Urban Champions: The Politics of Spatial Development and has contributed extensively to leading China studies and social science journals. Dr. Jaros holds a Ph.D. and M.A. in political science from Harvard University and an A.B. in public and international affairs, along with a certificate in Chinese language and culture, from Princeton University. He also earned a graduate certificate in Chinese studies from the Hopkins-Nanjing Center. Sara Newland is associate professor of government at Smith College. She is a scholar of local politics in China and Taiwan, with a research focus on how local officials operate both as domestic policymakers and as participants in international relations. Her work on local governance and public service provision has been featured in The China Quarterly and Governance, and her recent research explores subnational diplomacy, particularly the role of state and local officials in shaping U.S.-China-Taiwan relations. Dr. Newland holds a Ph.D. and M.A. from UC Berkeley and a B.A. from Wellesley College. Together, Dr. Jaros and Dr. Newland spent the past year as visiting fellows at the Truman Center for National Policy on a project examining city-level US-China relations. The white paper they have authored based on this research will be released in late February. They are also co-authoring a book on U.S.-China subnational diplomacy in an era of growing great power competition.
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51:14
BRICS in Focus: A Conversation with Dr. Mihaela Papa
In this episode of the ChinaPower Podcast, Dr. Mihaela Papa joins us to explore the significance of BRICS and its evolving role in reshaping global governance. Dr. Papa begins by examining the importance of this platform, such as the BRICS countries' central role in addressing major global development challenges, and its goals as an organization, such as striving towards a more equitable multipolar world order. She discusses the group’s rapid expansion over the past two years and delves into the key factors driving its growing appeal among countries in the Global South. The conversation focuses particularly on China's role within BRICS, highlighting how it leverages the bloc to advance its strategic objectives on the global stage. Particular attention is given to China's efforts in pushing for innovation and AI cooperation and the bloc’s de-dollarization agenda. Dr. Papa concludes by evaluating the effectiveness of BRICS and examining the strategic implications it presents for U.S. policy. Dr. Mihaela Papa. Dr. Papa is a BRICS expert from MIT Center for International Studies, where she serves as the Director of Research and Principal Research Scientist. Before joining MIT, she co-founded and led the Rising Power Alliances project and taught sustainable development and global governance at The Fletcher School at Tufts University. She began her BRICS research over a decade ago as a postdoctoral fellow at Harvard Law School and a visiting scholar at Fudan University's Center for BRICS Studies. Dr. Papa has published extensively on the rise of new powers and their coalition-building efforts. Her recent publications in International Affairs and the European Journal of International Relations explore when BRICS converge and how they can challenge the United States. She has also analyzed BRICS's de-dollarization efforts in the Chinese Journal of International Politics and Cambridge University Press Elements and written on the China-India conflict within BRICS in the Global Policy journal. Her commentary was featured in Foreign Affairs and The Conversation, as well as on Bloomberg, BBC, News24, the South China Morning Post, and other media outlets. Originally a trade economist with a BA from Croatia, she completed her MA in Law and Diplomacy and PhD in International Relations at The Fletcher School, Tufts University.
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31:36
China’s Polar Ambitions: A Conversation with Dr. Matthew Funaiole and Mr. Brian Hart
In this episode of the ChinaPower Podcast, Dr. Matthew Funaiole and Mr. Brian Hart join us to discuss China’s ambitions in the polar regions. They start by explaining China’s scientific, commercial, strategic, and diplomatic interests in the polar regions and how the polar regions fit into China’s broader strategy of leveraging “new strategic frontiers” to expand its influence, outpace rivals, and set global rules and norms. Dr. Funaiole touches on the differing geopolitical environments of the Arctic and Antarctic and how this shapes Beijing’s approaches to the two regions. Mr. Hart then provides insights on the dual-use potential of China’s polar research stations and how China can use these to achieve military and intelligence goals. They then discuss China’s challenges in forming Arctic partnerships and its growing collaboration with Moscow. They conclude with an assessment of the significance to U.S. security interests and offer thoughts on how Washington can work with allies and partners to advance their shared interests. Matthew P. Funaiole is vice president of the iDeas Lab, Andreas C. Dracopoulos Chair in Innovation, and senior fellow in the China Power Project at the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS). He specializes in using data-driven research to address complex policy issues, with a focus on Chinese foreign policy, dual-use technology, and maritime trade. In 2022, he launched the “Hidden Reach” initiative, which leverages open-source intelligence to uncover poorly understood sources of Chinese influence and examine how China advances its strategic interests through commercial and scientific ventures. Brian Hart is deputy director and fellow of the China Power Project at CSIS, and he also helps to lead the CSIS “Hidden Reach” initiative. Brian’s research focuses on Chinese foreign and security policy, China’s military and defense industrial base, Taiwan security issues, U.S.-China relations, and Chinese technology policy.
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41:21